Curse

Magus · May 16, 2005, 02:54 AM // 02:54

The expansions will contain new maps (maybe an altogether new world map, although there are plenty of spots on the current map that an expansion could take place in), but regardless, they could add a new oriental area that would fit the shinobi/assassin profession that wouldn't be out of place. (Kind of like how the White Mantle look Egyptian in an otherwise European world.)

A suggestion for the Shinobi (I'm thinking more in the general assassin context) is having the primary attribute be dual-wielding weapons. Aside from being cool, it really adds something different to the Shinobi profession, making it more distinct from the others (which I think is very important, since the current 6 professions and their combinations already cover so many areas). There will have to be a default damage penalty for having two weapons equipped, otherwise they'll be dealing insane damage, and the dual-wielding attribute will bring the damage closer to 100% as it is increased. This attribute obviously does not apply if the Shinobi is using only weapon.

I somewhat agree with Thraxus that the Shinobi may be un-needed though (although I don't think the out-of-place thing is really a problem, as new areas will be added). I'm really wondering what new professions could be added though, since combinations of the current six cover just such a wide area.

I like both the Shinobi and Chronomancer ideas, as they potentially offer something different in a profession that the current 6 do not have.

The Sleepless One · May 16, 2005, 03:15 AM // 03:15

I was actually quite suprised when I found out that monks were healers and not fighters. If they were fighters, I would without a doubt be one hands-down.

Zarconis · May 16, 2005, 10:28 AM // 10:28

I think the support and longevity of this post is a result of two thing.

1. There is a huge influx of new people that have not read this idea 20 times over. Just use the search function. You'll see my posts on Dual Wielding as well as many others on ninja/rogue type classes.

2. The original poster wrote with such a ... we'll call it passion, that it's hard not to respond to the effort.

My response to this thread is this.

Take out the dual wielding as that will probably be another profession entirely. I really like some of the ideas for this particular class. It could have some very effective LONG recharge type skills that fit the "one hit" mold.

I could definitely see "stealth" being alot like the Beast Mastery line. Where as you have to equip "Stealth" on your skill bar to even use the other skills associated with it. You might use "Smoke Grenade" which is the equivalent of blind, but only to target actually trying to attack you. Or maybe even invisibilty which would be deactivated upon your first action. I.e. you can get a free hit in or perhaps a 1second start to a preparation..

Some nice ideas, albeit there's been many like this one before it.

stylow · May 17, 2005, 01:21 PM // 13:21

since we are going animé style now

why not add character upgrades, like super warrior 4 or warrior final form, or like merge 2 characters so that you have ultimate characters which can do super big bang attack or transform into a huge golden ape :P

BahamutKaiser · May 17, 2005, 10:40 PM // 22:40

I see you've all reverted this thread into an arguement about other ideas brought up, whatever, half of these statements don't even pertain to this idea at all. Furthermore, I do have it on personal origin and respect for the arts (martial arts) as well as extended experience and lineage that my concepts of martial artist are more concrete then whatever some D&D regect saw in some other game, which is totaly unoriginal and completely undeveloped.

I said it already, this class isn't over powered because they suffer the same limitation as any other job, limited amount of points to invest and limited selection of skills, if you did a complete overview of any jobs capabilities you would see the same pattern overpowered exponentially functional play, but then you limit him to a certain number of attribute points and 8 skills available to use, every job has covers all the neccessities to play and compete without a secondary, making all combinations useful because none of them are neccissary, secondary classes are for versatitily and originality.

The vast majority of you are short sighted and ignorant. Just read over your statements and see how ignorant these comments are, and how poorly developed they are. You may not be one of those people, but I doubt it. An idea does not need the approval of other players to be considered, if any Developers find this thread they will read my idea and consider it for themselves, but thank you all for refreshing it with your poorly developed, side track, and totaly ignorant statements, it just keeps it closer at hand to be picked up by developers who may or may not consider it.

The idea behind Shinobi is a cool fun character to use, that provides an unique and original class function, based on legitimate and factual combat techniques used in many different martial arts. This game emulates a closer reality then most other games, with thier healing class monks instead of fighting class novilty shaolin monks, and thier specific mage definitions, like elementist who specificly uses elemental magic instead of the broad term "sorcerer" or "wizard". Shinobi is also a very realistic class application, with it's multipe martial arts combinations and assassination techniques. You claim that using all of this would be to powerful, but he can't use all of it, he can use a better combination of his abilities with the design that I set forth, but that would require a weaker point spread on several attributes and only 1 or 2 skills for 1 or 2 weapon classes, unless your daring enough to spread points across all his stats developing an extremely versitile/weak Shinobi who will do very poorly in many things.

I've only seen one developed rebuddle in this whole thread, and it didn't have any legitimate support disclosing the disfunctionality of this idea, only that they don't like it, don't think it will work, or simple and baseless insults, which is alot of the same thing that everyone else has to say. If you realy think that this game revolves around a "Western" world then your oviously only looking at the "world" you have seen so far, which is only the "Western" style world that the game begins in. The actual "world" that this game takes place in goes from desolate deserts, to ice peak mountains, to tropical paradises. Just like a real world, different cultures and even combat classes would exsist. Even more so, the storyline makes referrance to the Rift, which connects to all times and dimentions, leaving the game open to explore countless worlds and totaly different settings. Just because Shinobi doesn't match up with the way YOU SEE THE WORLD, and the exsitance of certain classes already noted in the start game senario does not exclude it from the opportunity to be added as a class. Furthermore, there are no additional characters around ascolon practicing unavailable classes which WILL be in expansions, which means whatever classes are added to the game, no matter what they are, will come with adaptation and original characters being added to suit those classes as they start the game.

These things I have understood from the time I read the story content behind the game, things that all of you overlook (which qualifies as ignorance), wile you complacently drop names of other classes you would like without any bearing to the thread focus or any kind of legitimate or original function/explanation (falling under poorly developed), and making completely illigitimate statements like, I don't think they "belong" here, or this isn't and "eastern" focused games (based on what? what you saw when you turned that game on? what do you know about the storyline or the full breadth of the game, including whatever they wish to add). I have stated no lies, if you don't like my ideas then continue to bump my thread with your ignorant comments, and I'll thank you for keeping my idea on top of the forums, but it is very ovious at this point that none of you lack the ability to develop a legitimate disfunction with my idea. I have covered all the neccissary balance issues outside of actually trying it and balancing the exact stats into a real class, the only ground you have is to like or dislike it, and if you possibly can, find a flaw, which can be remedied anyhow, and still be used.

Thank You again, for your "support" =D

Paloma Song · May 17, 2005, 11:50 PM // 23:50

Well, I like the idea, regardless of who had it first or when it was first posted. More variety of the creative sort, is always a good thing.

However, I'm a little curious about all the replies freaking out over the suggestion of mixing various cultures' fantasy themes. Not only has GW already done that (and done it well), but... where exactly is the harm? Why such disdain for, and I quote, "kung fu crap"? Fantasy is fantasy, folks... what differentiates it is imagination, depth, and story - not the country or culture that gave it life. I hope the devs, contrary to some of the less-enlightened players in this thread, are focusing more on making the game as unique, colorful and entertaining as possible using the best stuff out of world fantasy mythos, rather than focusing narrowmindedly on a certain tired old spin on the western medieval romance tale. It is also my hope that poorly conceived prejudices continue to play no role in the creative process surrounding this game.

As to the person who said there's nothing about a monk that harkens to the Asian theme besides faces (and, as was pointed out by another poster later), clothes, and that everything else about the monk is part of western fantasy... I suggest to you that there is nothing about the monk's spells that harkens to a European theme, either. Scrolling through the monk skill list on this very site shows that every single spell is generic in its wording, save spells like 'Dwayna's Kiss' which relates directly to GW's pantheon. There is nothing Asian or European about 'Smite Hex', 'Pacifism', 'Aura of Faith', and so forth, other than the fact that they are written here in English. Considering the earliest medieval fantasies were written in an older form of French, I hardly think that relevant.

Thematically, the game doesn't pull strictly from European roots either. Post-apocalyptic tales, the cult-in-the-jungle, and the Egyptianesque-cross-desert-trek are not themes present in the traditional/original Western fantasy epic, but Guild Wars adopts them to good, if not entirely original, effect.

For those of you who don't like the idea of one spin or another on the European or Asian rogue/thief/assassin/ninja/etc class, that is of course an opinion to which you are entitled, and it might even be the correct one. But your opinions would carry more weight if they were to show how such a class isn't necessary, or that another class would be better, rather than to veto it on its cultural origins alone. That argument simply carries no weight, in light of the game's present adaptation of so many cultural mythologies.

DarrenJasper · May 18, 2005, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Bahamut, if you think the devs

a) read these forums
b) have seen your post
c) have read your post past the 2nd line
d) will actually consider your idea

please pass me some of whatever it is you're smoking.

Z-Shinrei · May 18, 2005, 02:07 AM // 02:07

Nah, we don't need ninjas or shinobis, they just don't fit the environment. However, a possibility could be a mageknight. Its kind of a combination between a warrior and an elementalist, but its also quite different.

-They have more armor than elementalists, but less than warrioirs
-their armor has a slight hp and armor bosst, but also has a slight energy and energy regen boost --> more energy than warriors, less than elementalists
-they wield swords and spears (new weapon possibly), but not shields.
-their spells are stuff like moderate ranged elemental sword (kind of like a more powerful conjure element ability)

But the major thing is that they fit the "fantasy/mystical" environment.

BahamutKaiser · May 18, 2005, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Wow, everyone has thier own idea to post on this one

as if they are not capable of making an original or developed post.

First I would like to thank the guys that actually thought about it, disagree or not, I kind of breezed through the second page because most of if was back and forth about stupid inuendos.

As for a combination Warrior/Elementist class.... OMG there already is, it's called, Warrior/Elementist, moron. Another sightless moron who can't come up with any better idea then what he saw somewhere else. Any new job has to be original and provide a different playing experience, the ability to combine classes already exsist, any class idea revolving around a hybrid is completely idiotic. I.E. Paladin = Warrior/Monk, MagiKnight = Warrior/Elementist, DarkKnight = Warrior/Necromancer, Sorcerer = Elementist/Monk or ever how you view it. Any new classes will have to provide skills and possitions not already filled by other classes, and any hybrids will come from a combination like Shadow Assasin = Shinobi/Mesmer, (my fav) Sephiroth = Elementist/Shinobi, Barbarian = Warrior/Shinobi, Thief = Ranger/Shinobi and since everyone can't get off of a combat monk have a Monk/Shinobi which speciallizes in Kung Fu.

The point is that if they added it to the game and made preperation through the story line for this class in the game, you would love it, it covers all the classes your asking for and more, making all your other ideas completely inferior, if you could even call what you state ideas. If it was a real idea you would post it on its own forum and come up with a full spectrum of skills and explanations, but most of you arn't even reading it, and even more of you talk about how you think shinobi out of place. Thief with backstabing? that's real short, Rouge with dual wield?, Tell me what the general population is more familar with?, Dual wielding Rouges? or Dual wielding Ninjas? I guarrentee you that any kid in a modern society knows what a ninja is, unless your world revolves souly on D&D players you can agree that most people don't gather much meaning to rouge, more people associate it with the X-Men character then what you saw in WoW. Shinobi is a much, much, much better job class then thief or rouge, those are just ideas pasted from other games, not even original, can you say copyright?

Anyone who merits the time to respond needs to read the whole OP again, if your going to respond over and over again then you should read it over and over again, because I know you didn't, don't lie to me.

I am willing to wager that nearly 90% of the players who think the game doesn't have room for "asian" classes hasen't gotten out of ascolon, or read the story material from the guide, which means you actually have no forknowledge to back your view or claims, so consider this, educate yourself before you make an opinion, I don't need anymore "first graders" trying to debate whether or not something "fits", because you don't know what fits.

I would also like to appologize for my agrumentive tone, I get alot of stress elsewhere, reading "posted notes" left by "village idiots" gets annoying, but hey, the post is getting bumps so it works both ways.

Madjik · May 18, 2005, 10:17 AM // 10:17

I like your ideas about there being a shinobi class, I wont post why or how since all it will do is incite argument and im not one who enjoys such things.

I will say however that weather somthing fits or not into a story line is irrelevant for the simple reason that its a STORY. A way for ANYTHING to fit can simply be invented and it can be done in a way that will make the story more meaningfull, knowing how to do this is what defines a good author from a great one. As an example did you realize much of japanese culture remained isolated for eons? I cant give an exact date, my history isnt so good, but im mearly making a point here. The culture remained isolated from outside influence for ages more then most other civilizations, so an eastern influance can easily be introduced in a similar manner; keep in mind that that was only an example and there are likely tons of other ways to do it.

As far as thieves and rogues being evil goes, "scouts" use similar abilities and have many of the same qualities. So a kings spy (often in fantasy settings refered to as a scout) isnt inherently evil anymore then a priest is good, it's just a guy (or gal) using what skills he (or she) knows best for the good of his (say it with me "or her") country.

shinseikaze · May 18, 2005, 10:33 AM // 10:33

the attributes seems similar to the rogue class in WOW

dbodenheim · May 18, 2005, 11:00 AM // 11:00

I defintely think Bards should be included in the expansion. Area of effect songs would defintely be nice if they wernt overpowered. They could act sort of like the rangers nature rituals in terms of range. Maybe with a Crossbow attribute too?

The ninja thing though.............well, its been like 15 years since I was a sophmore in high school. Have fun with that though.

BahamutKaiser · May 18, 2005, 08:52 PM // 20:52

Perhaps nobody has notice yet, but the rangers already function as the "Scout" class, alot of thier missions are Scouting, and hunting the enemy and tactical assualts. Shinobi is a totaly different kind of spy focusing on staying hidden and martial arts attacks. Thief and rouge are already to much like ranger to implement, just look at rangers gear, the only thing missing is a knife. And the fact that Rouge was the name for dual wielder in WoW is even more insentive to not use the same damn name from thier own sister companies game, originality anyone?

The reason I enphasized the Shinobi title and not Ninja is for the same reason, originality, It isn't a name widely used for Ninja, and it causes players to think more about the meaning, which is built in to the kind of attacks and techniques they use.

If you want at thief, name your Ranger Robin Hood, there you got a thief. If you want a rouge, name your Shinobi ..... Rouge Zystra........ but the Shinobi class is better then rouge, Rouge is just a made up whatever class that has been instituted in other games, Shinobi is the real thing, and this game idolizes realistic class titles over the rainbow flavored everything else other games made up selection.

Qi Ang · May 18, 2005, 09:24 PM // 21:24

quick solution, make a R/W or a Mo/W.

Madjik · May 19, 2005, 01:50 AM // 01:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

Perhaps nobody has notice yet, but the rangers already function as the "Scout" class, alot of thier missions are Scouting, and hunting the enemy and tactical assualts. Shinobi is a totaly different kind of spy focusing on staying hidden and martial arts attacks. Thief and rouge are already to much like ranger to implement, just look at rangers gear, the only thing missing is a knife. And the fact that Rouge was the name for dual wielder in WoW is even more insentive to not use the same damn name from thier own sister companies game, originality anyone?

The reason I enphasized the Shinobi title and not Ninja is for the same reason, originality, It isn't a name widely used for Ninja, and it causes players to think more about the meaning, which is built in to the kind of attacks and techniques they use.

If you want at thief, name your Ranger Robin Hood, there you got a thief. If you want a rouge, name your Shinobi ..... Rouge Zystra........ but the Shinobi class is better then rouge, Rouge is just a made up whatever class that has been instituted in other games, Shinobi is the real thing, and this game idolizes realistic class titles over the rainbow flavored everything else other games made up selection.

I was only making a point about thieves and evilness in general. As I said before, I support the creation of this class, i think your ideas are innovative and give a fresh new melee class without severly pushing aside the warrior class. In fact, I belive it would make the warrior class even better by giving him more options to choose from for his battle styles, with a certain possibility to combine them in a very unique way.

Shinobi/Warrior ~ Warrior/Shinobi .... oh yea, I would love that. I belive you'd have to make most of the moves based on energy not adrenaline in order to help balance this out a bit. In truth i see this class working a bit more like a battle mage then anything else, with some skills being attributed passivly to weapons or fighting and others being set up in the same way elementalists, monks and mesmers use thier magic.

BahamutKaiser · May 21, 2005, 10:27 AM // 10:27

The skills types are loosly explained but I will clarify further what I am suggesting, whether it would be balanced enough would be determined by testing.

Ninjitsu Skills would be mostly energy based if not all, they are all escape, trap, sneak up, and backstabing moves, which means building up adrenaline would defeat the use of "Sneak Up" moves. Many of these would be available to other classes, but oviously would never gain the power that the Shinobi could use with them.

Kung Fu Skills would be almost all adrenaline moves, much like warrior melee attributes, because it cannot stack with warrior skills, it cannot cause an influx of power by combining it with warrior, because it would be no different then a warrior with skills and abilities in 2 weapon classes, they are sperate, and only Shinobi has the ability to combine his Kung Fu skills with his other attacks effectively (through points in Ninjitsu attribute).

Wing Chung would be the skill many warriors and would covet for the ability to use 2 weapons. The weapons would both hit at the same attack cycle as a 2 handed or something close, initially giving them a higher hit rate. But putting stats in Wing Chung doesn't increase damage or attack speed, it increases blocking rate. Players who use Wing Chung will get the ability to use 2 weapons with only 1 point in Wing Chung, but you would rely on mastery in other attributes for increasing damage, otherwise they would just use 2 weapons, this includes wands. The skills in this class are all mainly defensive and counter moves, and would require energy or adrenaline. Players who want to do damage are more likely to use skills from another attribute to do damage, the reason is because the counter damage is dependant mostly on Kung Fu, blocking the weapon with thiers, and attacking with kicks/knees/elbows. So in order to increase counter damage for Wing Chung you would have to have points in Wing Chung and Kung Fu, which is very deficient for a Warrior to do damage, so they will mostly use points and skills in thier own attributes with a few in some Wing Chung for a key defensive move. Wing Chung would be linked to martial arts weapons of the 1 handed sort, but not increase damage in them, but certain Ninja swords can be used for Warrior sword skills, and are improved by Sword Mastery. This suggestion may not work if it is too overpowerred, but the way Shinobi is set up, they will end up putting many points in Ninjitsu, Kung Fu, and Wing Chung to use Wing Chung effectivly, so they would be trading off damage to use sword skills and put points in sword mastery.

Kenjutsu only works with its own weapon, the Large Samurai Katana, so this would also not link to other Warrior attributes in an unbalanced manner, little different then a W/R using a bow. Because the main super effective skills you gain from Kenjutsu are on long recharge times (20 seconds to 1.5 mintues, 3 minutes for thier final ultra move), it is hard to tack on Kenjutsu moves repeatedly, this is ment to be mixed with other Shinobi moves to fill in the gaps, they mix thier skills well with Ninjitsu attribute, other jobs like mages could have points in this and throw down thier Kenjutsu move then step back making Melee fighting available to them wile Warriors may have a hard time alternating between skills in Kenjutsu but have some better damage with points in Strength. The majority of these moves skills would be signets, with preperation time and reuse time as thier balancers, unlike Warrior attacks that execute instantly, Kenjutsu moves require a short pause, just like a spell cast. This mostly entails the 7 special skills modeled after the 7 tenants of Kenjutsu, or something simular to them. Kenjutsu is not ment to have dozens of moves, Ninjitsu is suppose to have many moves more then most primary attributes have, wile Kenjutsu would have the fewest (at least as I envision it). Only 1 or 2 decent adrenaline moves and 1 or 2 decent energy moves. But if they did want several moves then they should be alot of the same, or upgrades of the same thing. As an elite skill Kenjutsu should have a fatal move that requires casting time, 20 energy, and 3 minute reuse, which dashes at the enemy for up to a bow shot and..... well basicly kills thier opponent in some form or fashion. I know the first thing that comes to mind is that it is unfair to have moves that can possibly instantly dispatch enemies. But at the end of the game there are dozens of moves to interupt moves, and they can be killed in the amount of time it takes to cast a skill if it takes to long, or they are just unlucky, there is nothing unfair about it, they are just inverted spells, like the damage of end game fire magics with the use of a weapon.

As for Shinobi energy, they should have the same energy as warrior (20), with 1 point of regeneration on one of there armor pieces (standard) giving them 3 arrows of energy regeneration. This allows them to use energy moves equivalent to warrior with more frequency.

Shinobi is a tactical class, if you don't use the skills they would lose to a warrior hands down, but with thier skills they are very hard to beat in melee, common warrior skills would fall to common Shinobi skills. But there are alot of pitfalls to attacking with fast pace hits, as well as hit and run tactics. For one, empathy and insidious parisite (I may have the wrong necro move wrong) both do damage depending on how many hits you do, doing damage in dozens of small hits will get you killed very fast if you have these curses/hexes on you, Favoring the use of Kenjutsu against casters. Wile fighting against melee combatants, which is only the warrior realy, would demand Ninjitsu and Wing Chung moves to overcome thier target. Because of the Shinobi setup they can possibly use all of thier traits together to have attacks for every situation, but just like warrior, Shinobi has very poor healing options Forcing them to look into certain skills from other classes to survive. A few powerful melee and magical damage reducing skills would exsist, but aside from a weak move like healing signet at the begining of the game, Shinobi would have nearly no healing abilities. Which would also be a liability for anyone seconding shinobi, expecially warrior (who would get a major amount of damage power out of the combination). 2 or 3 powerful mid and endgame healing skills should be available to Shinobi in order to provide a decent survivability to combinations like W/S or E/S, but they would never be able to take damage like a W/Mo, and if they don't use thier counter moves very well, or escape damage, Shinobi combinations can be very deficient. This compliments combinations like S/Mo, Mo/S, S/N, and N/S who can heal themselves proficently.

I'll delve into more detail some other time if others show interest. I'm sure I'll get another page of rants though

Madjik · May 21, 2005, 10:57 AM // 10:57

maybe you will maybe you wont.

But not from me

It sounds like you've put a HUGE amount of thought into this and I like your thinking. Under your proposel, a warrior/shinobi or vice~a~verse, while quite powerful and deadly, would have to rely far to heavly on a healer (human or otherwise) to be effective. This creates a nice balance, forcing you to choose weather to beat your foe sensless as fast as possible or add some sort of support as a secondary in order to offset it so you can fight for longer periods of time. Your idea's on the duel wielding are also very intresting, increasing defensive power over dmg and would probably be the perfect balance since it also forces you to choose either extra power with a war secondary or better healing with for example the monk.

Any thoughts on armor? Gi's or somthing more like a samurai's cerimonial armor? Maybe somewhere between a mages and a rangers AL or closer to a warriors? Furthermore which of the above listed attributes would be shinobi only?

BahamutKaiser · May 21, 2005, 11:29 AM // 11:29

I think I already commented on Armor, but I'll elaborate. And I already stated that Ninjitsu is the primary attribute, the OP has a very elaborite explanation as to why Shinobi uses multiple martial arts, and why Ninjitsu is its primary. And alot alot of discussion on the mechanics.

There armor is between Warrior and Ranger for Defense, no added energy, but 1 point of energy regeneration on the body piece (standard). Closer to Ranger in actuall normal armor points. Because Kung Fu attacks are bare handed and would have the most difficulty breaking through armor the Shinobi glove and shoe armor would have an assortment of edged, spiked or blades or small claws on them, which give a very small amount of added damage to thier Kung Fu attacks which they would almost have to use in thier mix of attributes. This gives them another edge in hand to hand combat if someone else comes against them with Kung Fu.

I totaly overlooked the part of the Kung Fu skills as well, many of them would focus on hitting a certain part of the body, wile normal Kung Fu attacking would suffer from the reduction of damage due to the full armor, the skills would hit on certain body parts, which would only include the enemies armor for that body part. So if the enemy has weaker armor in certain spots or simply weak armor in general Kung Fu will put some decent damage through.

The armor would look Ninja like, starting with tightly wrapped, light gear. Thier further sets would have guards on the shins, forarm, and shoulders. Thier armors would feature reduced damage from attacks, just like ascalon gear, they would have enough defense lower then Warrior though as not to compare though, only 10 or so more armor then average ranger armors. Thier defensive armor would have added evasion on it, looking dark and shadowlike very espionage like. Thier light armor (energy armor) would have no added attack damage to thier Kung Fu attacks but have a bit more energy then others, and look like Samurai Formal Robes, not Samurai Battle Armor. And thier Common armor would have the best Kung Fu attack bonus to it with blades along the shin and foreare as well as small blades on the fist and foot. Shinobi armor would be more about the bonuses rather then the amount of defense they have, having the same defense as the ranger would be fine, as long as the defensive and attack mods are much better.

BahamutKaiser · May 25, 2005, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by relientK_fan

Kenjutsu wasn't the code of samurais... It was Bushido.

Bushido is the complete way of the samurai, I'm limiting to the use of a Katana, which is Kenjutsu, not all the aspects of samurai.

BahamutKaiser · May 26, 2005, 05:31 AM // 05:31

This game goes way further then castles and knights, which are just the begining. In expansions the advanced areas and backgrounds open the story environment for Shinobi class.

What you think belongs isn't a legitimate argument, and without any explanation, you may as well save your opinion for idiots who will ignorantly agree with you.